Author Topic: Last question  (Read 878 times)

Offline thedoc298

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 79
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Last question
« on: May 09, 2019, 03:25:01 AM »
Im starting to dive into the bits of Synchronous Verses Asynchronous for my spark gap. Some say the best is Asynchronous and some say Synchronous. From what I have read the Synchronous would lock on at 120, 240 ....and such. But how is Asynchronous lined up to fire at the correct time, I don't seem to fully comprehend the Asynchronous spark gap and the pro's and con's of both.

Offline MRMILSTAR

  • High Voltage Engineer
  • ****
  • Posts: 201
  • Karma: +4/-0
  • Cedar Rapids, Iowa
    • View Profile
Re: Last question
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2019, 06:00:36 AM »
The short answer to your question is that there are no fixed firing points for an asynchronous RSG. The firing points will wander slowly through the sine wave as the motor RPM drifts with time.

The primary advantage of a ARSG (asynchronous) over a SRSG (synchronous) is simplicity. In order to make a SRSG, you need a synchronous motor powerful enough to spin the disk. These are usually made from regular non-synchronous induction motors by grinding either 2 flat spots (for a 3450 RPM motor) or 4 flat spots (for a 1725 RPM motor) on the armature. This will then make the motor synchronous at either 3600 RPM or 1800 RPM. Then you have to phase the motor disk so that the spark gap electrodes fire at the peak points of the sine wave (60 Hz or 50 Hz) when charging the capacitor for 120 BPS (60 Hz) or fire at the peak sine wave points and the zero-crossing points for 240 BPS (60 Hz). The reason for doing all this is to make the firing points correspond to the maximum charge on the capacitor. This results in the maximum power delivered to the primary coil per bang.

The ARSG is much simpler. It just uses a regular induction motor with no modifications. The firing points happen at arbitrary points along the capacitor-charging sine wave. Thus the amount of power per bang delivered to the primary coil changes and drifts with time as the motor RPM wanders. With only 2 or 4 flying electrodes, you can even experience variation in streamer length and sound volume as the firing wanders along the sine wave.

With greater than 4 flying electrodes the difference between the SRSG and ARSG diminishes and the synchronism is of little value.

I built my SRSG from a 1/2 HP 3450 RPM induction motor by grinding 2 flats 180 degrees apart on the armature. It now runs synchronously at 3600 RPM. I set the firing points using an optical detector on the disk along with an oscilloscope to monitor the firing points. I rotated the motor until I got the firing points that I wanted. Then I locked down the motor. I use 4 flying electrodes so I get 240 BPS firing at 0 degrees, 90 degrees, 180 degrees, and 270 degrees on the sine wave.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2019, 10:57:02 PM by MRMILSTAR »
Steve White
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Retired electrical engineer

Offline thedoc298

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 79
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Last question
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2019, 03:44:43 AM »
Thanks very much for the clear explanation.

High Voltage Forum

Re: Last question
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2019, 03:44:43 AM »

 


* Recent Topics and Posts

post Re: Help needed: HV Driver circuit
[Transformer (Ferrite Core)]
T3sl4co1l
July 06, 2020, 10:29:17 PM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
petespaco
July 06, 2020, 06:53:26 PM
post Re: adventures in homemade flyback bobbins.
[Transformer (Ferrite Core)]
HighVoltageRulezz
July 06, 2020, 01:18:03 PM
post Re: Help needed: HV Driver circuit
[Transformer (Ferrite Core)]
HighVoltageRulezz
July 06, 2020, 01:05:32 PM
post Re: Help needed: HV Driver circuit
[Transformer (Ferrite Core)]
T3sl4co1l
July 06, 2020, 06:14:56 AM
post Re: Cathodes in Compact Fluorescent Lamps
[Light, Lasers and Optics]
klugesmith
July 05, 2020, 06:31:21 PM
post Re: Cathodes in Compact Fluorescent Lamps
[Light, Lasers and Optics]
HiVi
July 05, 2020, 12:30:02 PM
post Re: IGBTs keep dying (un-solved again)
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 04, 2020, 10:35:50 PM
post Re: IGBTs keep dying (un-solved again)
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
davekni
July 04, 2020, 08:56:15 PM
post Re: Next Gen DRSSTC
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 04, 2020, 04:37:32 PM
post Re: IGBTs keep dying (un-solved again)
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 04, 2020, 04:14:44 PM
post Dell PowerEdge M1000E Blade Server Teardown
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
Mads Barnkob
July 04, 2020, 01:52:14 PM
post Help needed: HV Driver circuit
[Transformer (Ferrite Core)]
HighVoltageRulezz
July 04, 2020, 12:37:48 PM
post Re: Easy to build Polyphonic MIDI Interrupter
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
Max
July 04, 2020, 12:17:47 AM
post Cathodes in Compact Fluorescent Lamps
[Light, Lasers and Optics]
klugesmith
July 03, 2020, 07:12:18 AM
post Re: What's needed to heat up 0.75 g of SiC (susceptor) mass until it turns dim-red??
[Radio Frequency]
klugesmith
July 03, 2020, 06:36:16 AM
post Re: IGBTs keep dying (un-solved again)
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
davekni
July 03, 2020, 04:20:42 AM
post Re: "Slayer exciter" analysis
[Solid State Tesla Coils (SSTC)]
acmq
July 03, 2020, 03:01:56 AM
post Re: Easy to build Polyphonic MIDI Interrupter
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
AstRii
July 02, 2020, 11:17:48 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
MRMILSTAR
July 02, 2020, 11:09:25 PM
post Re: Differential probe testing setup
[Laboratories, Equipment and Tools]
TMaxElectronics
July 02, 2020, 10:57:02 PM
post Re: Differential probe testing setup
[Laboratories, Equipment and Tools]
Twospoons
July 02, 2020, 10:47:18 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
johnf
July 02, 2020, 09:03:20 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
DJthefirst
July 02, 2020, 08:01:03 PM
post Re: Easy to build Polyphonic MIDI Interrupter
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
Max
July 02, 2020, 07:04:55 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 02, 2020, 07:02:30 PM
post Re: IGBTs keep dying (solved for now)
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 02, 2020, 06:51:20 PM
post Re: Easy to build Polyphonic MIDI Interrupter
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
AstRii
July 02, 2020, 05:34:23 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
DJthefirst
July 02, 2020, 05:09:09 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
TMaxElectronics
July 02, 2020, 12:51:29 PM
post Differential probe testing setup
[Laboratories, Equipment and Tools]
TMaxElectronics
July 02, 2020, 12:20:18 PM
post Re: How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
MRMILSTAR
July 02, 2020, 05:30:41 AM
post How to prevent secondary oxidation / Rust
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
DJthefirst
July 02, 2020, 04:16:58 AM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
petespaco
July 02, 2020, 01:02:02 AM
post Re: What's needed to heat up 0.75 g of SiC (susceptor) mass until it turns dim-red??
[Radio Frequency]
T3sl4co1l
July 01, 2020, 06:54:30 AM
post Re: "Slayer exciter" analysis
[Solid State Tesla Coils (SSTC)]
T3sl4co1l
July 01, 2020, 06:25:30 AM
post Re: "Slayer exciter" analysis
[Solid State Tesla Coils (SSTC)]
acmq
July 01, 2020, 02:47:13 AM
post Re: A three-phase "tree phase" Tesla coil
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
Steve Ward
July 01, 2020, 02:43:34 AM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
aes92000
July 01, 2020, 02:33:07 AM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
petespaco
July 01, 2020, 12:03:08 AM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
aes92000
June 30, 2020, 10:34:36 PM
post Re: E-Bay Marx generator
[Voltage Multipliers]
ritaismyconscience
June 30, 2020, 09:14:06 PM
post Re: What's needed to heat up 0.75 g of SiC (susceptor) mass until it turns dim-red??
[Radio Frequency]
ritaismyconscience
June 30, 2020, 09:05:32 PM
post Re: induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
ritaismyconscience
June 30, 2020, 09:01:55 PM
post Re: A three-phase "tree phase" Tesla coil
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
Weston
June 30, 2020, 08:22:33 PM
post Re: "Slayer exciter" analysis
[Solid State Tesla Coils (SSTC)]
Weston
June 30, 2020, 07:54:40 PM
post "Slayer exciter" analysis
[Solid State Tesla Coils (SSTC)]
acmq
June 30, 2020, 05:13:57 PM
post induction heater troubleshooting help
[Electronic Circuits]
aes92000
June 30, 2020, 04:08:34 PM
post Re: 100$ Thermal Camera With 32x32 Pixel. HTi HT-02D Unboxing And Test
[Laboratories, Equipment and Tools]
Mads Barnkob
June 30, 2020, 02:54:22 PM
post Re: A three-phase "tree phase" Tesla coil
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils (DRSSTC)]
Mads Barnkob
June 30, 2020, 01:04:30 PM

Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 
SimplePortal 2.3.6 © 2008-2014, SimplePortal