Author Topic: UD 2.7C Build  (Read 3028 times)

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
UD 2.7C Build
« on: February 26, 2019, 04:40:45 AM »
Well, I just could not sit still after giving up on my last project, so I decided to have a go at building a Universal DRSSTC Driver 2.7C.
I never soldered SMD before, so I was a bit doubtful of my skills, but it turns out that it is quite easy even with an el-cheapo USB Microscope.
It took quite a few hours, I did not want to rush, still I had to take 2 components off because I put them wrong way around ( removing components without a hot air gun is not easy ).
Lag from the camera was giving me sea sickness 😁, but I got there.
Board is completed except for a few Build/IGBT specific components - I still do not know what IGBT’s to use on my coil ( I decided to convert my current TC to solid state ).
I did not even power up my board to test  because I do not have an interrupter to do a complete test.
I found some plans for interrupters here:

https://github.com/profdc9/DRSSTC-PCB-Pack

Are these any good, or is there anything more suitable ?

Finally here is my board, if you something wrong, please do not hesitate to comment !




« Last Edit: February 26, 2019, 04:46:04 AM by Thunderstruck »

Offline oneKone

  • High Voltage Engineer
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
  • Karma: +7/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2019, 08:34:39 AM »
 Damn that is a nice looking board!

For interrupters I use a standard burst mode type designed by Steve ward, and for midi I use onetesla interrupter. I haven't looked at the interrupter profdc9 has released, but if the through hole ud2.7c is anything to go by they should be top quality.

Offline Mads Barnkob

  • Administrator
  • High Voltage Expert
  • *****
  • Posts: 1179
  • Karma: +17/-0
  • Denmark
    • View Profile
    • Kaizer Power Electronics
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2019, 09:01:36 AM »
It looks nice, I guess one of the specific components you say is missing, that I could see, is the OCD current transformer resistor?

I am not sure if Dan ever tried building his interrupter, but it should be a good standard interrupter. There is also alternatives as the good old and simple steve ward interrupter: http://stevehv.4hv.org/drsstc_interrupter.htm and I also have the plans for a simple non-midi audio interrupter from ctc-labs: http://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/tesla-coils/musical-sstcdrsstc-interrupter/
For midi I use loneoceans midi2 kit.

You can drive bricks up to around CM600s with these drivers, so there is plenty to choose from, depending on the size of your coil and resonant frequency :)

http://www.kaizerpowerelectronics.dk - Tesla coils, high voltage, pulse power, audio and general electronics

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2019, 01:03:39 PM »
Damn that is a nice looking board!

For interrupters I use a standard burst mode type designed by Steve ward, and for midi I use onetesla interrupter. I haven't looked at the interrupter profdc9 has released, but if the through hole ud2.7c is anything to go by they should be top quality.

Hi oneKone,
Thanks, that is my first SMD build, never tried soldering that small.
I found profdc9’s github repository, that is the link I posted at the start of the thread.
He does say that it is work in progress, that is why I wasn’t sure if those plans are any good.
Everything is there, I especially like Gerber files for the pcb’s, makes everything so much easier.

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2019, 01:33:36 PM »
It looks nice, I guess one of the specific components you say is missing, that I could see, is the OCD current transformer resistor?

I am not sure if Dan ever tried building his interrupter, but it should be a good standard interrupter. There is also alternatives as the good old and simple steve ward interrupter: http://stevehv.4hv.org/drsstc_interrupter.htm and I also have the plans for a simple non-midi audio interrupter from ctc-labs: http://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/tesla-coils/musical-sstcdrsstc-interrupter/
For midi I use loneoceans midi2 kit.

You can drive bricks up to around CM600s with these drivers, so there is plenty to choose from, depending on the size of your coil and resonant frequency :)

I discovered loneoceans’s kit recently, seems like a good quality circuit, a bit on the expensive side, but not too bad. I am seriously considering just buying one.
As far as missing components are concerned, yes C33 is missing and also Slot 7 inductor ( cannot find one locally, getting one from abroad is going to be pricey because of shipping )

I cannot remember resonant frequency of my coil, I’ll have to measure it again. Complicating issue is that I cannot do it any time soon because someone filled my garage with tons of furniture, and my coil is right behind it.
It is a 4 inch secondary, 1050-ish turns of 25AWG wire, Primary is pancake coil, 600mm OD, 150mm ID. 12 inch toroid top load.
MMC based on16 x 942C20P15K Capacitors for a total of 9.3nF
Based on these numbers JavaTC gives me 400kHz resonant frequency on the secondary.

And looks like I will not have to modify my existing coil, I have a spare secondary, spare MMC, and left over 1/4 inch conductor for another primary. Just need a top load !

You can see my coil in action here:
/>

Offline dexter

  • High Voltage Enthusiast
  • *
  • Posts: 28
  • Karma: +2/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2019, 06:23:40 PM »
here's a home made version of UD2.x
doesn't look that great but it does the job and it was a fun learning experience

Offline profdc9

  • High Voltage Engineer
  • ****
  • Posts: 232
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2019, 05:20:33 PM »
I build both of the lineinterrupter and the standard interrupter and they both work.  However, I did tweak the standard interrupter slightly since I built it to make it more similar to the line interrupter.  I am fairly certain they both work.  The thing I tweaked on the standard interrupter is the MIDI support to correct something to be consistent with the lineinterrupter so they should both be nearly identical now.

The lineinterrupter triggers off of the 50/60 Hz AC cycle line to best match the power factor of the bridge to the peak of the AC cycle.  The idea is it allows the capacitors to charge during the cycle before allowing the interrupter to fire.  I did not have a problem blowing any oscilloscopes or anything like that, but because the power I have is limited I was not able to push this hard without tripping the overload in the breaker.

The standard interrupter has four modes:  standard test mode, which is basically pulsing the interrupter periodically for a particular pulse length, burst mode, which is to try to get briefer, more intense sparks, the MIDI interrupter, which can be used for playing MIDI files from a computer through USB, and the external audio sequencer, which if you play a tone like, for example, from a guitar, will generate a set of pulses with controlled length.  You can see it in action here

/>
Hopefully that helps you understand the state of it.  So I did build both, but the standard interrupter has a few fixes in it from the last tested version.

Dan

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2019, 08:28:09 AM »
Dan, thank you very much for your help. I ordered a few PCB’s from Pcbway, I will try to build one of your interrupters. Very generous of you to give away all the files for free.

Offline Mads Barnkob

  • Administrator
  • High Voltage Expert
  • *****
  • Posts: 1179
  • Karma: +17/-0
  • Denmark
    • View Profile
    • Kaizer Power Electronics
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2019, 09:35:35 AM »
The standard interrupter has four modes:  standard test mode, which is basically pulsing the interrupter periodically for a particular pulse length, burst mode, which is to try to get briefer, more intense sparks, the MIDI interrupter, which can be used for playing MIDI files from a computer through USB, and the external audio sequencer, which if you play a tone like, for example, from a guitar, will generate a set of pulses with controlled length.  You can see it in action here

The code for the ATTiny, is that the onetesla usb midi code that you have a folder backwards in the same git? I did not find a clear description of which software was for it.

http://www.kaizerpowerelectronics.dk - Tesla coils, high voltage, pulse power, audio and general electronics

Offline profdc9

  • High Voltage Engineer
  • ****
  • Posts: 232
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2019, 03:55:35 PM »
Yes the OneTesla code is there.  You will need an AVR programmer and avrdude, which costs $5 on ebay, and the hex file is already there.   There are instructions in the folder with the software.

Dan

The standard interrupter has four modes:  standard test mode, which is basically pulsing the interrupter periodically for a particular pulse length, burst mode, which is to try to get briefer, more intense sparks, the MIDI interrupter, which can be used for playing MIDI files from a computer through USB, and the external audio sequencer, which if you play a tone like, for example, from a guitar, will generate a set of pulses with controlled length.  You can see it in action here

The code for the ATTiny, is that the onetesla usb midi code that you have a folder backwards in the same git? I did not find a clear description of which software was for it.

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2019, 10:03:51 PM »
I still did not power up my board, but I would like to check te voltages at least. Would it be safe to turn it on wthout GDT’s connected also without C33 and the slot 7 inductor installed ?

Offline Mads Barnkob

  • Administrator
  • High Voltage Expert
  • *****
  • Posts: 1179
  • Karma: +17/-0
  • Denmark
    • View Profile
    • Kaizer Power Electronics
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2019, 09:51:40 AM »
I still did not power up my board, but I would like to check te voltages at least. Would it be safe to turn it on wthout GDT’s connected also without C33 and the slot 7 inductor installed ?

As long as you do not have unloaded/unconnected outputs of gate drive ICs, there should be nothing wrong with powering it up to check voltages etc.

The problem with the gate drive ICs like UCC32xxx, MAX44xx etc is that they can oscillate in the MHz region when the output is left open loop and it will destroy itself from switching losses.
http://www.kaizerpowerelectronics.dk - Tesla coils, high voltage, pulse power, audio and general electronics

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2019, 12:21:57 PM »
So I must connect a couple of GDT’s to it then ?

Offline dexter

  • High Voltage Enthusiast
  • *
  • Posts: 28
  • Karma: +2/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2019, 09:33:29 PM »
So I must connect a couple of GDT’s to it then ?

the UCC32xxx in a UD2.7 drives some mosfets so i don't see a problem with powering it up without a GDT connected

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2019, 10:32:32 AM »
I studied loneoceans’s instructions on initial power up of the board, nowhere did he mention that GDT’s must be connected, he even mentioned that if there is no GDT’s connected, there should be no signal on the outputs.
So, I gathered enough courage to power up my board, I set my power supply to 24V DC at 200mA max.
To my relief, blue LED came on, and there was no smoke leaks anywhere, current draw 0.02 A.
So far, so good  :)

While I was procrastinating whether to power it up or not, I built an enclosure for it.
PCB’s for the interrupter are on their way, most of the components are available locally. Only problem is fibre optic connector - can’t find it anywhere.



Offline profdc9

  • High Voltage Engineer
  • ****
  • Posts: 232
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2019, 04:27:03 PM »
The fiber optic connector is from Industrial Fiber Optics.  You can get it from digikey

https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=IFE97

The plastic fiber is not easy to find.  It might be better to order both the IFE97 and the plastic fiber from Industrial Fiber Optics directly, but it is more expensive.

If you want to attach your own fiber optic output rather than using the LED, there is a port J15 with +V, zero volts, and a digital output.  You can build a simple circuit with a NPN transistor and the LED of your choice instead on a little external perfboard with literally three components (resistor, transistor, and LED).

Dan

I studied loneoceans’s instructions on initial power up of the board, nowhere did he mention that GDT’s must be connected, he even mentioned that if there is no GDT’s connected, there should be no signal on the outputs.
So, I gathered enough courage to power up my board, I set my power supply to 24V DC at 200mA max.
To my relief, blue LED came on, and there was no smoke leaks anywhere, current draw 0.02 A.
So far, so good  :)

While I was procrastinating whether to power it up or not, I built an enclosure for it.
PCB’s for the interrupter are on their way, most of the components are available locally. Only problem is fibre optic connector - can’t find it anywhere.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 04:37:45 PM by profdc9 »

Online Hydron

  • Administrator
  • High Voltage Engineer
  • *****
  • Posts: 273
  • Karma: +8/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2019, 07:19:40 PM »
If you look on eBay you should be able to find some cheap skinny spdif optical cables for audio use. The 2.2mm (I think) diameter is suitable for these POF optical links, especially short ones

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #17 on: March 07, 2019, 06:13:26 AM »
Ok, I ordered those parts from Digikey and Ebay, few other pieces to get free shipping too  :)

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2019, 04:09:41 AM »
I think it would be a good time to start considering selection of IGBT for this project. I just measured frequency of my secondary coil, and it comes at 365 kHz.
This is just the coil, no top load, no streamer simulation ( FG, resistor and the scope technique )

With a 12” toroid as a top load, JavaTC shows that frequency should drop to about 260 kHz.
A well written selection guide (over at Kaizer  :) ) makes me think that IXGN60N60C2D1 would be a good start. Good choice ?
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 10:02:21 PM by Thunderstruck »

Offline Thunderstruck

  • High Voltage Experimenter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2019, 08:59:29 PM »
I just connected the three indicator LED’s ( signal, OCD and power), powered up the board and to my surprise the OCD light came on as well as the power light.
Is this normal ? Board still has no Inductor, C33 or any of the jumpers installed. I am hoping that is the reason for the OCD trigger, otherwise I made a mistake assembling it.

High Voltage Forum

Re: UD 2.7C Build
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2019, 08:59:29 PM »

 


* Recent Topics and Posts

post Re: My first DRSSTC on bricks
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils]
Laci
Today at 08:35:24 PM
post Re: How To Make a Stencil For Spray Paint With Cheap Hand Tools
[General chatting]
johnf
Today at 07:53:35 PM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
Today at 02:52:58 PM
post Re: Royer oscillator (ZVS) driven Jacob's ladder, E80 core transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
Today at 02:42:19 PM
post Re: Full bridge much "weaker" than half bridge?
[Solid state Tesla coils]
nick
Today at 11:17:36 AM
post Re: Royer oscillator (ZVS) driven Jacob's ladder, E80 core transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
davekni
Today at 04:51:08 AM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
davekni
Today at 04:26:22 AM
post Re: How To Make a Stencil For Spray Paint With Cheap Hand Tools
[General chatting]
AndreiRS
Today at 01:21:35 AM
post Re: Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
Twospoons
December 11, 2019, 10:49:04 PM
post Re: A dynamical arc model v2
[Dual Resonant Solid State Tesla coils]
Uspring
December 11, 2019, 05:28:46 PM
post Re: Full bridge much "weaker" than half bridge?
[Solid state Tesla coils]
Fumeaux
December 11, 2019, 03:11:42 PM
post Re: Royer oscillator (ZVS) driven Jacob's ladder, E80 core transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
December 11, 2019, 02:22:10 PM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
December 11, 2019, 02:09:19 PM
post Full bridge much "weaker" than half bridge?
[Solid state Tesla coils]
nick
December 11, 2019, 01:10:57 PM
post Re: Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
kamelryttarn
December 11, 2019, 08:48:36 AM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
davekni
December 11, 2019, 06:08:48 AM
post Re: SSTC low voltage at gate transformer and heating drivers
[Solid state Tesla coils]
davekni
December 11, 2019, 05:38:17 AM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
davekni
December 11, 2019, 05:01:31 AM
post Re: Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
John123
December 11, 2019, 01:52:43 AM
post Re: Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
klugesmith
December 11, 2019, 01:41:04 AM
post Re: Worlds Weirdest Microwave Oven, From A Weapons Factory - The Husqvarna Cupol
[Transformer (iron core)]
klugesmith
December 11, 2019, 01:37:13 AM
post Re: Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
John123
December 11, 2019, 01:19:58 AM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
jturnerkc
December 11, 2019, 01:14:32 AM
post Re: Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
klugesmith
December 11, 2019, 01:04:08 AM
post Re: SSTC low voltage at gate transformer and heating drivers
[Solid state Tesla coils]
babass
December 10, 2019, 11:24:50 PM
post Using same winding on separate rails?
[Transformer (iron core)]
John123
December 10, 2019, 10:52:50 PM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
December 10, 2019, 03:35:40 PM
post Re: Why did 4HV die??
[General chatting]
John123
December 10, 2019, 03:21:07 PM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
Mads Barnkob
December 10, 2019, 03:04:28 PM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
December 10, 2019, 02:57:45 PM
post Re: Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
kamelryttarn
December 10, 2019, 11:23:48 AM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
Mads Barnkob
December 10, 2019, 10:27:54 AM
post Re: Worlds Weirdest Microwave Oven, From A Weapons Factory - The Husqvarna Cupol
[Transformer (iron core)]
Mads Barnkob
December 10, 2019, 10:20:17 AM
post Re: Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
Mads Barnkob
December 10, 2019, 10:16:32 AM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
davekni
December 10, 2019, 06:04:28 AM
post Re: Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
davekni
December 10, 2019, 05:28:54 AM
post Re: Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
davekni
December 10, 2019, 04:12:29 AM
post Duty cycle when driving a CRT TV flyback transformer
[Transformer (ferrite core)]
John123
December 09, 2019, 10:52:59 PM
post Replacement guide for Windows Media Center
[Computers, Microcontrollers, Programmable Logic, Interfaces and Displays]
MRMILSTAR
December 09, 2019, 08:29:16 PM
post Re: Sense coil fabrication?
[Induction launchers, coil guns and rails guns]
Uspring
December 09, 2019, 04:23:33 PM
post Re: Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
MRMILSTAR
December 09, 2019, 03:59:02 PM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
jturnerkc
December 09, 2019, 03:41:42 PM
post Possible use for large inductor (laminated core)
[Transformer (iron core)]
kamelryttarn
December 09, 2019, 09:43:11 AM
post Re: SGTC MK1 - An Accomplishment in Progress
[Spark gap Tesla coils]
davekni
December 09, 2019, 12:53:57 AM
post Re: CW multiplier resistor string suggestions
[Voltage Multipliers]
davekni
December 08, 2019, 09:57:51 PM
post Re: CW multiplier resistor string suggestions
[Voltage Multipliers]
MRMILSTAR
December 08, 2019, 05:28:09 PM
post Aethra CCD Webcam Teardown - From Back When Streaming Was Expensive!
[Electronic circuits]
Mads Barnkob
December 08, 2019, 01:33:30 PM
post Platter resistance & inductance
[Induction launchers, coil guns and rails guns]
klugesmith
December 08, 2019, 11:41:00 AM
post Re: CW multiplier resistor string suggestions
[Voltage Multipliers]
davekni
December 08, 2019, 06:50:11 AM
post Re: CW multiplier resistor string suggestions
[Voltage Multipliers]
plasma
December 08, 2019, 12:00:00 AM

Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30