Author Topic: General Questions  (Read 1651 times)

Offline flyingperson23

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General Questions
« on: January 06, 2022, 04:42:25 AM »
Obligatory am noob.

I'm building my first drsstc, so far with 680v bus, and I've just ordered 2 4700uF voltage doubler/bus caps and 4 cm300ha-24h's for a full bridge.

I've read that the higher powered cm bricks need beefy GDTs, but I'm not sure exactly what that means. Is it just that the gate sucks a lot of current?

I salvaged these (pictured) from a plasma cutter, where, and I could be completely wrong, but I think they were used for gate drive there. Are they useful for a drsstc?

Also from the plasma cutter, I got 2 25A S25VB100 rectifiers; will they be sufficient?

Finally, would it be preferred to make a new topic for each question I have or post replies to a topic I've previously made?

Thanks!


Offline AstRii

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2022, 08:17:09 AM »
Using salvaged cores for a GDT is always a bit dodgy as you don't know properties of the cores. Though you can always just try to wind it and see how will those waveforms look like and according to the waveforms you can try different windings count until you hit the sweet-spot. This may or may not work, some cores are totally useless for GDT purposes even ferrite ones.
Beefy GDT means that the GDT has to transfer a lot of current without saturating. This usually means big cross section of the core. When designing a GDT I always make sure that the magnetic flux will reach maximum of 100mT.

Also from the plasma cutter, I got 2 25A S25VB100 rectifiers; will they be sufficient?

That depends. You cannot easily predict how much power will your DRSSTC consume without knowing what duty cycles and OCD values will it run. CM300 coils usually run in the 5kW-10kW range which means a current flow of up to 40A (assuming 240VAC input). This means that you probably need to put both of them in parallel.

EDIT: Also as I'm looking at those cores you sent on the picture, to my eyes they look more like iron powder cores, those would be impossible to use as GDTs in DRSSTCs.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2022, 08:20:58 AM by AstRii »
Marek Novotny
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Offline Mads Barnkob

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2022, 09:33:06 PM »
Welcome to HVF :)

Have you looked at/read the DRSSTC design guide? https://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/tesla-coils/drsstc-design-guide/

For GDT calculations, I got some notes under my Kaizer DRSSTC 1 article: https://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/tesla-coils/kaizer-drsstc-i/ so you can get an estimate of the needed core sizes. To get the gate drive current needed, I have a calculator: https://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/calculators/igbt-gate-drive-calculator/

A full-bridge of CM300 can easily pull some 10-15 kW from the wall, so a couple of 25A rectifiers in parallel will be just on the brink of 3 phase 400VAC 25A, ~15kW, so if you are only using single phase or lower voltages, they are not big enough.

The inductors you show looks like input filter or output chokes, they are not suitable for GDTs.

As long as you have general DRSSTC questions, you could continue in this thread. You could also make a "project" thread for your coil build where you show your build process and also ask questions and discuss solutions on the way. Some times if a topic is very specific and could be a de-railing of your original thread, its better to make new ones :)

Looking forward to see you coil throw lightning!

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Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2022, 06:36:28 PM »
I just got my cm300ha-24h bricks in the mail. Should I remove the rtcs? If so, how? I found loneoceans guide, but I have slightly different bricks.

Thanks again, y'all are amazing!

Offline thedoc298

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2022, 03:10:32 AM »
I just got my cm300ha-24h bricks in the mail. Should I remove the rtcs? If so, how? I found loneoceans guide, but I have slightly different bricks.

Thanks again, y'all are amazing!

I don't have the information, but I would get the coil going first and then at a later time do the mod. Save a headache or two.

Offline Mads Barnkob

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2022, 07:41:34 PM »
I just got my cm300ha-24h bricks in the mail. Should I remove the rtcs? If so, how? I found loneoceans guide, but I have slightly different bricks.

Thanks again, y'all are amazing!

Wait for it to be a problem and make your bridge easy to take apart for service!

I made a guide on how to do it on CM600s: https://kaizerpowerelectronics.dk/teslacoils/cm600du-24fa-igbt-removal-of-rtc-over-current-protection/ and a video about it:
/>
Judging from the spark output alone, there was not much difference, I dont think I have any measurements saved anywhere...
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Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2022, 03:46:58 PM »
Alright thanks, I won't remove the RTC's for now. I got my bus caps and I'm looking at whether or not I should get new rectifiers now. Are there any advantages of using multiple smaller (25A) rectifiers or a single large (100A) module other than heat dissipation? Also, which bus bars need to be kept short for high currents or skin effect? I know the IGBT output bars should be short and physically close, but should I do the same for the DC bus and have the rectifier and caps mounted on the same physical bars as the bricks? Or would it be just as good to have them as a separate module and just connect it to the bridge with wires?

Offline alexhanyuan

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2022, 03:57:04 AM »
CM300HAs don't have RTCs, it's only the F series IGBTs that do.

Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2022, 01:37:54 PM »
Ok, thanks for your help. I'm starting to build the main parts and maybe going a bit overkill but metalwork is fun. Here's what I have so far; will any of this not work? I know the busbars aren't ideal but it's the best I could do with 4 full bricks.

Offline Rafft

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2022, 12:05:45 AM »
those busbars will do. my bus caps(epcos) have aluminum terminals, so its fitting to use aluminum material for busbar as well. Ideal would be copper(lesser loss) though.



Mads
nice vid! no wonder those bricks are SO expensive
SGTC / SSTC / DR-SSTC / QCW

Offline davekni

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2022, 05:22:18 AM »
Quote
I know the busbars aren't ideal but it's the best I could do with 4 full bricks.
How do the brick busbars join with the bulk cap busbars?  It looks like it will be with wires.  At minimum, the snubber cap needs to be on the brick H-bridge.  More than one snubber cap if possible to minimize parasitic inductance, such as a snubber or two on each side of the H-bridge.  Many larger coil builds I've seen here use a common busbar structure for bricks and bulk caps (and snubber caps).

My DRSSTC does use wires from bulk caps to H-bridge.  H-bridge has many large snubber caps.  Wire connection is multiple pairs of smaller wires to minimize inductance, one Vbus+ and one Vbus- in each pair.  That isn't typical, but I have relatively little voltage headroom, 450Vbus with 650V IGBTs, so cannot afford excessive Vbus ring at the end of bursts.
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Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2022, 01:16:33 PM »
I'm planning to make some spacers and directly bolt the bridge busbars to the cap ones, so the cap terminals will be facing the top of the bricks, so the snubber will be as close to across the bricks as possible. The snubber I have is 5uF. Do I need more? And is there a better place to put them? Will this whole design work, or will it have too high inductance and force me to redo the whole thing?

Offline davekni

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2022, 05:10:57 AM »
Quote
I'm planning to make some spacers and directly bolt the bridge busbars to the cap ones, so the cap terminals will be facing the top of the bricks, so the snubber will be as close to across the bricks as possible. The snubber I have is 5uF. Do I need more? And is there a better place to put them? Will this whole design work, or will it have too high inductance and force me to redo the whole thing?
Joining with spacers is a good plan.  Of course, spacers should be aluminum or copper, not steel.  With joined bus bars, snubber location may be fine.  Might be OK even with no snubber.  You have plenty of margin between 680Vbus and 1200V IGBTs.  Would require 520V switching spikes to hit 1200V.  Do you have access to an oscilloscope?  Measuring switching spike amplitude with short bursts would help to make sure margin is reasonable.  That can be done with primary coil only to avoid needing to scope while sparks are flying.
David Knierim

Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2022, 12:50:18 AM »
Yep, I have a scope, I'll make sure it all stays within 1200V

Offline flyingperson23

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Re: General Questions
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2022, 03:12:39 AM »
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Re: General Questions
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2022, 03:12:39 AM »

 


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